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Welcome with open arms fellow believers who don’t see things the way you do.
And don’t jump all over them every time they do or say something you don’t agree with
– even when it seems that they are strong on opinions but weak in the faith department.
Remember, they have their own history to deal with. Treat them gently. Romans 14.1: The Message
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#110122 - 01/21/07 05:51 PM Re: Problems In The White Community *** [Re: John317]
Kountzer Online   content


Registered: 10/18/02
Posts: 621
Loc: Houston, Texas
I was influenced by this sda uncle of mine early. I didn't join the church til much later. When I was in the 8th grade I used to hang out with the older boys, guys that were already in high school. We would play sandlot ball, walk to the high school games, stuff like that. Along the way, they would all be talking about the autobiography of malcolm x, and eldridge cleaver's soul on ice. Naturally, I had to read those books also. Malcolm x had the biggest influence on me. I read soul on ice to find out what happened to the black power movement after Malcolm had left the scene.
I intrinsically knew 3 things then: that sda stuff my uncle was telling me about the sabbath and all was the truth. Before that I attended a baptist church. I knew that Malcolm's choice to become a muslim was not the way to go, not for me anyway. I also knew that the fact that Eldridge Cleaver used maoist type communism as the basis of his beliefs was an even worse way to go.
I haven't paid much attention to Cleaver since then, and that was at least 30 years ago.

DB
_________________________
Jesus Christ was a community organizer, Pontius Pilate was a governor.

There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

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#110124 - 01/21/07 05:53 PM Re: Problems In The White Community [Re: Toothfairy]
John317 Moderator Online   content


Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 10414
Loc: CA
Originally Posted By: Toothfairy
Problems in the white community?
Interesting what you wrote here saying "It might help to know or remember that the last years of his life, Cleaver had serious health problems, including diabetes, which can affect one's thinking and judgment."

That fact about diabetes is new to me. I never heard that before.
A certain type of diabetes has this Forum's boss.
Can we draw similar conclusions on his thinking and judgments?


Not necessarily. It depends on many factors, not least of which is whether the person who has it is controlling his blood surgar level through diet and proper uses of insulin. Many people don't follow the doctors orders about it and lots of people have diabetes but aren't aware of it.
_________________________
Turning and turning in the widening gyre/ The falcon cannot hear the falconer;/ things fall apart; the center cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world... Surely some revelation is at hand;/Surely the Second Coming is at hand. W.B. Yeats


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#110129 - 01/21/07 06:27 PM Re: Problems In The White Community [Re: Kountzer]
John317 Moderator Online   content


Registered: 11/13/05
Posts: 10414
Loc: CA
Originally Posted By: D_Bishop
... they would all be talking about the autobiography of malcolm x, and eldridge cleaver's soul on ice. Naturally, I had to read those books also. Malcolm x had the biggest influence on me. I read soul on ice to find out what happened to the black power movement after Malcolm had left the scene.
I intrinsically knew 3 things then: that sda stuff my uncle was telling me about the sabbath and all was the truth. Before that I attended a baptist church. I knew that Malcolm's choice to become a muslim was not the way to go, not for me anyway. I also knew that the fact that Eldridge Cleaver used maoist type communism as the basis of his beliefs was an even worse way to go.
I haven't paid much attention to Cleaver since then, and that was at least 30 years ago.
DB


Cleaver wrote a companion piece called Soul on Fire, explaining his change from Leftist revolutionary to Christian.

I think you made the right choice to avoid those radical ideologies. I was very attracted to them at one period of my life. Vietnam radicalized a lot of young people during the late 60s and early 70s. It sort of swallowed up the Civil Rights Movement because the issue of the war was viewed as more crucial since the main objective of CRM, the Civil Rights Act, had already been passed.

I was a teenager when Cleaver was a presidentail candidate on the Peace and Freedom ticket. He made appearances on various TV talk shows, including the Louis Lomax show, which I used to watch a lot. But not very long afterwards, Cleaver and some other Black Panther's were involved in a shoot out with police. There were people killed in that gun battle and Cleaver was arrested. Cleaver jumped bail and went to Cuba and eventually on to Algeria. From there he wrote some good stuff, including fiction that was published in Evergreen, a highly reputable literary magazine of that time. I followed Cleaver's experiences closely in those days because I admired him very much, along with Che Guevara and Fidel Castro. One time I walked down a street in San Francisco and was robbed by about 5 black teenagers only a little younger than I was. They took a camera and my wallet and some other personal stuff. Then I started talking to them about Cleaver and within a few minutes they had given my things back to me. That shows the interest in Eldridge Cleaver among even the kids on the streets of the black community in those days.

Today I find that such kids don't care for the most part about political and social issues. I try to get them interested in reading books and in history but it's hard going. I've never even found one among the kids I take care of who's heard of Eldridge Cleaver, much less read his book.




Edited by John317 (01/21/07 06:47 PM)
_________________________
Turning and turning in the widening gyre/ The falcon cannot hear the falconer;/ things fall apart; the center cannot hold; Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world... Surely some revelation is at hand;/Surely the Second Coming is at hand. W.B. Yeats


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#110248 - 01/22/07 03:50 AM Re: Problems In The White Community [Re: John317]
Kountzer Online   content


Registered: 10/18/02
Posts: 621
Loc: Houston, Texas
Some parts of San Franciso are dangerous for anyone, white, black or whatever. Places like the tenderloin, some parts of the mission district, even along Market street.
_________________________
Jesus Christ was a community organizer, Pontius Pilate was a governor.

There is a fine line between "hobby" and "mental illness."

Top
#110256 - 01/22/07 05:33 AM Re: Problems In The White Community [Re: Kountzer]
Amelia Administrator Offline
Here Forever, by Request :)

Registered: 07/30/01
Posts: 18470
Loc: Out standing in a field
Quote:
Places like the tenderloin


I don't even want to think about how that name came to be.
_________________________
"Earth - insane asylum for the universe." - Maxine

" Do not love the world or anything in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him..."1 John 2:15-16

Fairview Or

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#111796 - 02/10/07 02:36 PM Re: Problems In The White Community [Re: bevin]
olger Online   content


Registered: 12/27/05
Posts: 3183
Loc: Ohio
 Originally Posted By: bevin
Why do you think poor church attendance is a problem? Maybe it just shows an accurate assessment of how useful attending church is!

Why do you think homosexuality is a problem? Is there any evidence at all that its incidence today is higher than in the past or in other groups today?

/Bevin

If a person's heart is locked, going to church only frustrates them.

olger

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