Here is a question I might use to start my Sabbath School class discussion:

In what ways is the story of Jacob and Rachel a story of love - and a story of dislike and near hatred?

The terms "dislike and near hatred" are hard for me to reconcile with Jacob's feelings for Leah.

His feelings toward Laban, on the other hand might have included those terms - but then one wouldn't expect Jacob to retaliate against Laban by treating Leah poorly.

Or would one?



BTW, I really enjoy your comments on the S.S.lessons each week!

There's the old saying - "All's fair in love and war." Sometimes I think the two are about the same, especially with some people. Jacob could have been one of those.

However, the SDA Commentary seems to bring out the fact that Leah had quite a few children whose father was Jacob so there must have been some attraction between the two. Of course, you can do tender things for selfish reasons.

I would have to say Jacob does not win my respect in connections with his actions, nor does Rachel seem to be the beauty who shows her true nature in her hatred for her sister. Even God sees the hatred for Leah and opens her womb while Rachel remains barren. Jacob doesn't seem to have any problems of conflict with the custom of going into the handmaids of the wives to "supply" children. Its interesting to consider Leah, and being firstborn and the custom concerning her being married first. Here again Jacob tries to beat the "firstborn" custom as with his brother only this time he is the victim. Perhaps God was teaching him something after all?! Just thinking out loud.

He had no choice! To live with a woman you didn't love after working and waiting 7 yrs for someone you truly love, would be a living hell. And if he didn't marry both and they all lived together, it would sooner or later result in adultery.

And here's a question: When Eliezer was sent on an errand to find a wife for Isaac, he prayed and met the right one, Rebekah. Jacob goes to Padan Aram, and the Bible does not record that he prayed for anything like Eliezer did, but still met the very one, the one to become his wife. The question is: Does prayer make a difference? Would Eliezer not found Rebekah had he not prayed? How much better would it have turned out for Jacob had he prayed?

Gerry

Jacob suffered the consequence of fulfilling the plan in a negative process and not merely because the "firstborn" custom was destroyed in his time. Well, he is now the victim of the same reason, "lie". But his love was directed to how he put determination on himself to serve another 7 years just to get he wants and who he loves most. In this situation, he still rule out the significance of firstborn by suffering another 7 years in serving Laban just to get Rachel.

He didn't have his 7 or is it 70 virgins, but he did have four; and he didn't have to blow himself up to get them!

Gerry

yep... no pressure on him for it was all free flow.but beyond those sticky women, only rachel that he worked out for, the rest are all stickers. imagine the 7 years of service to know that he was deceived by not telling earlier the custom, and serve another 7 years just to get rachel...

and oh! that would be nice if Jacob prayed before he took his first step in acquiring rachel. right? like what youv'e said, in the case of eliezer, he did prayed thought it's not Isaac who really asked by prayer

James423
Is there any particular reason that Jacob didn't have a dowry to present to Laban for a suitable wife? Just was wondering if it had been because of the deception or what?

Jacob had nothing in hand when he fled from his brother. He arrived in Laban's territory empty; his only intention is to hide from the snares of Esau's revenge.It's not in his plan before he fled that he'll find a wife but his thought were preoccupied with fear. The moment he saw Rachel is the only time plans of marriage poped up in his brain. Because he has nothing to give as dowry by that time, the transaction and contract was formulated: to serve Laban for 7 year. It was a silent form of dowry in both parties, a nonverbal confirmation but using the intellect in understanding (Jacob was good in nonverbal translation as the events shows). Well, deception has a part towards the dowry. Laban allowed service for 7 years as a dowry because he got a black plan even with the rule of customs. Without the knowledge of custom by Jacob, he know that Jacob will be willing to add another 7 years of service just to get Rachel (for he love Rachel so much and it was demonstrated by his actions and determinations which provided a hint for Laban in hid black plan). Laban know that Jacobs service will bring properity to his household (for 14 years) and that's more than a dowry equavalent to be given to Laban in impromptu.

[Don't know if this has already been mentioned here...]

Even though Jacob served a second "term" of seven years in order to have Rachel as his wife, the Scripture implies that Rachel was given to Jacob at the end of the wedding week celebration for Leah's marriage.

So he was actually married to both women concurrently.

The reason Leah's children were all older than Rachel's children was that "Rachel's womb was barren" until years later when God granted her prayer and allowed her to have two sons: Joseph and Benjamin.

Do you agree that this is the correct understanding of the Scripture and of EGW on this subject?

Yes, Jeannie I understand that to be the case also. Didn't realize that Rachel did pray that God would help her but in carefully reading the text I see that she did in verse 6 as she is also praising Him for answering her plea. Thank you for pointing that out. I also noted that Isaac pleaded with the Lord on Rebekah's behalf but Jacob appears not to have followed that course. Jacob does not appear to understand yet the importance of the spiritual blessing as he is surrounded with children of his own pro-creating. So much to see in each of these relationships! Amazing Grace!

Was wondering how "love at first sight" in other words he was taken with her looks translates into a life time of bliss? Jacob knew very little about Rachel when he made the "deal" for 7 years in exchange for Rachel as his wife. Is there somewhere else you are speaking from that I might get a more detailed account of this pre-nuptual agreement? Scripture talks of their getting closer over the seven years but at the time of the agreement Jacob only knew Rachel's beauty. Doesn't seem as though there is any heavenly imput either as there was with the servant praying before Rebekah came to the well.

He knew he was safe in falling in love with her, because she was from his mother's side of his same family. Actually, she was his first cousin. So at least he'd be marrying someone with the same background as he.

I guess marrying one's first cousin wasn't frowned upon in those days.

The Bible says it was after staying with his uncle for a month that his uncle made a business proposition, so he had a month to get to know her. Living in the same house, he certainly would have learned a lot about Rachel.

Gerry

I have always wondered how Jacob did not realise it was Leah before he had fully committed himself, so to speak....it does not seem that there was much communication of the verbal kind involved.

No, and I guess that she was under strict instructions to "keep your mouth shut!!"

Beryl

This is a valid point.

olger

In the Sabbath School discussion, one member brought out that perhaps God was trying to tell Jacob not to marry Rachel, that she had little to commend her beyond her beauty.