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#136170 - 07/25/07 12:20 PM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: annie]
Sweet Offline
Beginning to post a bit...

Registered: 07/22/07
Posts: 15
Loc: 7,107 Islands,Bacolod City, Ph...
Jacob had nothing in hand when he fled from his brother. He arrived in Laban's territory empty; his only intention is to hide from the snares of Esau's revenge.It's not in his plan before he fled that he'll find a wife but his thought were preoccupied with fear. The moment he saw Rachel is the only time plans of marriage poped up in his brain. Because he has nothing to give as dowry by that time, the transaction and contract was formulated: to serve Laban for 7 year. It was a silent form of dowry in both parties, a nonverbal confirmation but using the intellect in understanding (Jacob was good in nonverbal translation as the events shows). Well, deception has a part towards the dowry. Laban allowed service for 7 years as a dowry because he got a black plan even with the rule of customs. Without the knowledge of custom by Jacob, he know that Jacob will be willing to add another 7 years of service just to get Rachel (for he love Rachel so much and it was demonstrated by his actions and determinations which provided a hint for Laban in hid black plan). Laban know that Jacobs service will bring properity to his household (for 14 years) and that's more than a dowry equavalent to be given to Laban in impromptu.

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#136210 - 07/26/07 12:49 AM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: Sweet]
Jeannieb43 Offline
Princess of Pasadena

Registered: 12/29/01
Posts: 2585
Loc: California
[Don't know if this has already been mentioned here...]

Even though Jacob served a second "term" of seven years in order to have Rachel as his wife, the Scripture implies that Rachel was given to Jacob at the end of the wedding week celebration for Leah's marriage.

So he was actually married to both women concurrently.

The reason Leah's children were all older than Rachel's children was that "Rachel's womb was barren" until years later when God granted her prayer and allowed her to have two sons: Joseph and Benjamin.

Do you agree that this is the correct understanding of the Scripture and of EGW on this subject?
_________________________
Jeannie


...Change is inevitable; growth is optional....

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#136256 - 07/26/07 06:41 PM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: Jeannieb43]
annie Offline


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 82
Yes, Jeannie I understand that to be the case also. Didn't realize that Rachel did pray that God would help her but in carefully reading the text I see that she did in verse 6 as she is also praising Him for answering her plea. Thank you for pointing that out. I also noted that Isaac pleaded with the Lord on Rebekah's behalf but Jacob appears not to have followed that course. Jacob does not appear to understand yet the importance of the spiritual blessing as he is surrounded with children of his own pro-creating. So much to see in each of these relationships! Amazing Grace!

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#136257 - 07/26/07 06:53 PM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: Gerry Cabalo]
annie Offline


Registered: 10/24/06
Posts: 82
Was wondering how "love at first sight" in other words he was taken with her looks translates into a life time of bliss? Jacob knew very little about Rachel when he made the "deal" for 7 years in exchange for Rachel as his wife. Is there somewhere else you are speaking from that I might get a more detailed account of this pre-nuptual agreement? Scripture talks of their getting closer over the seven years but at the time of the agreement Jacob only knew Rachel's beauty. Doesn't seem as though there is any heavenly imput either as there was with the servant praying before Rebekah came to the well. LS

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#136258 - 07/26/07 07:06 PM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: annie]
Jeannieb43 Offline
Princess of Pasadena

Registered: 12/29/01
Posts: 2585
Loc: California
He knew he was safe in falling in love with her, because she was from his mother's side of his same family. Actually, she was his first cousin. So at least he'd be marrying someone with the same background as he.

I guess marrying one's first cousin wasn't frowned upon in those days.
_________________________
Jeannie


...Change is inevitable; growth is optional....

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#136285 - 07/27/07 04:05 AM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: annie]
Gerry Cabalo Online   content


Registered: 03/20/00
Posts: 7418
Loc: Wilkesboro, NC
 Originally Posted By: annie
Was wondering how "love at first sight" in other words he was taken with her looks translates into a life time of bliss? Jacob knew very little about Rachel when he made the "deal" for 7 years in exchange for Rachel as his wife. Is there somewhere else you are speaking from that I might get a more detailed account of this pre-nuptual agreement? Scripture talks of their getting closer over the seven years but at the time of the agreement Jacob only knew Rachel's beauty. Doesn't seem as though there is any heavenly imput either as there was with the servant praying before Rebekah came to the well. LS


The Bible says it was after staying with his uncle for a month that his uncle made a business proposition, so he had a month to get to know her. Living in the same house, he certainly would have learned a lot about Rachel.

Gerry

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#136295 - 07/27/07 11:55 AM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: Gerry Cabalo]
Nan Online   ozflag
Benevolent Physician

Registered: 04/07/00
Posts: 6021
Loc: Sydney,Australia
I have always wondered how Jacob did not realise it was Leah before he had fully committed himself, so to speak....it does not seem that there was much communication of the verbal kind involved.

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#136299 - 07/27/07 01:16 PM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: Nan]
Beryl Online   content


Registered: 04/05/03
Posts: 2181
Loc: Perth, Western Australia
No, and I guess that she was under strict instructions to "keep your mouth shut!!"

Beryl
_________________________
"Grace is God doing for us, in us and through us that which He requires of us but which is impossible for us to do in or for ourselves."

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#136301 - 07/27/07 01:22 PM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: annie]
olger Online   content


Registered: 12/27/05
Posts: 3138
Loc: Ohio
 Originally Posted By: annie
Was wondering how "love at first sight" in other words he was taken with her looks translates into a life time of bliss? Jacob knew very little about Rachel when he made the "deal" for 7 years in exchange for Rachel as his wife. Is there somewhere else you are speaking from that I might get a more detailed account of this pre-nuptual agreement? Scripture talks of their getting closer over the seven years but at the time of the agreement Jacob only knew Rachel's beauty. Doesn't seem as though there is any heavenly imput either as there was with the servant praying before Rebekah came to the well. LS
This is a valid point.

olger

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#136922 - 08/04/07 02:53 AM Re: Lesson 4 (3rd 07) - Jacob and Rachel - DISCUSSION+ [Re: olger]
james423 Moderator Online   content


Registered: 01/22/05
Posts: 547
Loc: Dayton, Tennessee
In the Sabbath School discussion, one member brought out that perhaps God was trying to tell Jacob not to marry Rachel, that she had little to commend her beyond her beauty.
_________________________
James Brenneman

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