Hello eveybody,

I am from Holland, i ve been searching for truth almost 10 years now. I have got some really big problems. Every big issue in Seventh day adventism makes sense: the antichrist, the prophecies of Daniel, the uniting of church and state in America etc etc.

However when it comes to Ellen White i have some real big problems. She said that some present at the conference would be subject to the seven plagues. She said that an angel told her this. The bible says that only the father knows when Jesus returns. Furthermore this could not be a conditional prophecy because no matter how hard the early adventists would work, it was impossible for the nations to unite in a New World Order at their lifetime.

However there are many personal testimonies on the internet of people who have become sd-adventists. For example Professor Walter Veith:

http://video.google.nl/videoplay?docid=-...earch&plindex=1

Also doug Batchelor talks about divine intervention in his life.

My own thoughts on this matter: - maybe satan knows that in the endtimes there will be a revival for keeping the commandments of God, he hates it when people accept God s authority so he links his own authority with the Sabbathkeepers by using a false prophet in sheep clothes
- Maybe we should just ignore the mistakes of Ellen White and look at the bigger picture.

I wish God intervened in my life!

greetz,
from Holland

WELCOME truthseeker ... I am sure we will be blessed having you here.

You made the statement ...



I think this is a good idea. We need to look to the Bible. Ellen White has many many errors. She was not infallible. She is the lessor light. There is a lot of good in Ellen though. I am sure you can find some good if you are interested in her study. Like you say .... just throw out the bad and let the good in. OUT with the BAD ... in with the GOOD.

But I would stick with the Bible. Ellen is so abused. We are not to take her every word ... instead we are to look to the Bible.

She knew there would be fanatics about her writings. So, she tried to prevent this abuse when she said ....





You are safe with the words directly from the Bible rather than an intermediary.

The Good News of the Gospel is simple and plain enough for all to understand ... even those with limited resources.

God Bless your walk with Him. He will intervene in your life and He IS.

The problem with this is that the human heart is desperately wicked and therefore seeks for excuses to discard or ignore what it does not find convenient. It is the same reason many people don't study the Bible. They would rather be ignorant of it so they can on about their merry way feeling good about themselves.

The Bible also contains "errors," but they are not such as would cause anyone to be lost if they believed every word of the Bible. The same with Ellen White. Many will be lost because they rejected the Bible and the Spirit of prophecy, but I can't imagine anyone's losing their salvation because they followed what God revealed through Ellen White.

What, if anything, do you find "bad" in the Conflict Series, for instance, or in something like Steps To Christ?

Regards,
"John 3: 17"

If there is a desire to study Ellen White ... then I would highly recommend what you have suggested. Just be prepared to compare it with scripture and with the guidance of the Holy Spirit to discern ... throw out what does not mesh with scripture.

And I would rather not dwell on the things in her writings that are not scriptural. That is left between the individual and the Holy Spirit who guides. Like I say ... I just toss them . I could give you a long list ... but what would that serve. You would not agree. So, can we agree to disagree? Instead ... I will take the good that I find and be blessed with that. I don't have to believe that each and every word of hers was prophetic.

Thank you for all of your comments. I am only interested in the truth, even when it is very unpleasant to me. It is easy to believe in a cheap gospel and lies like "the law has been nailed to the cross". So you don t have to worry about my wicked heart, because if I wanted to believe in lies, i would already believe the attacks on seventh day adventism i have investigated on the many anti-websites.

But my problem is this: Ellen White claimed that an Angel told her that some of the conference would be alive at the return of Jesus. To me, this diametrically opposes the bible when it says that the predictions of a true prophet always come to pass. Conditionality, like i mentioned before, could not be the case here. So i was thinking to myself, maybe did the angel show the conference as a model for all the generations of seventh day adventists. My loyalty to scripture and personal experience in deception forbids me to ignore the possibility that Ellen White was in fact a deception. Ellen White herself said that we should throw away her writings when it contradicts the bible, but of course this could also be a subtile way to hide the fact that she was in fact not a true prophet.

However Seventh day adventists are the only constisten protestant denomination left that uphold the bible, so it would be better for the devil to not have invented these Christians in the first place. I do believe that Ellen White was a true prophet but before i take her writings as an authoritive source, i have to fill in all the inconsistent gaps.

I really appreciate you guys helping me out here,

OK, we're close to agreement here. I wouldn't say throw it out but rather put it on the back burner, like we would with the Bible when we see something that we either do not understand or that seems to be wrong. We can lay it aside and maybe come back to it later when we have read more or seen more evidence. Sometimes what seems to be wrong or contradictory at first is solved by something we see later on or even by the discovery of new information. In other words, don't be so hasty to conclude that either the Bible or Ellen White are wrong.

Just think how many SDAs would have lost out on blessings if they had waited for modern science to verify her writings before they acted on them. But because they went ahead and followed her advice on health even before science said she was right, many SDAs were able to be instrumental in verifying the truth of what God was trying to teach us.

Regards,
"John 3: 17"

No Problem there.

There are many things about Ellen White that will discourage you if you let it. Just take the good and don't be bothered with the bad. Just treat her like any other author you would read. This idea of ALL or NOTHING ... just does not wash with me. I know of NO author that I totally agree with every word on print. So, don't treat Ellen that way.

I would just dispense with this idea that she is a prophet. She may be ... but so what. It still means that you have to have the Holy Spirit impress you as to what she says is true ... of course after prayer and study.



There are lots of "authoritative sources" ... I would not sweat over that issue. And I am not sure what you mean by filling in the gaps. Again ... I would not worry about the gaps. She is not infallible. So, when you see error ... just shake your head and move on. It is far better to focus on the beauty of her writings when you study her ... than to focus on her error. The error is there for a reason I think. It just shows she is human and we should focus on the greater light ... the BIBLE of course.

May I suggest of few books to read that discuss the subject which you can access at this link: http://www.ellengwhite.org/

Messenger of the Lord by Herbert E. Douglass

A Prophet Among You by T. Housel Jamison. This book has a very good chapter on the Bible tests of a prophet.

Believe His Prophets by Rebok.

Arthur White's comprehensive biography of Ellen G. White.

The vision you refer to was in 1856. About 1900, Ellen White made the statement that Christ would have come about 6 years before if the church had fully accepted the message that God sent to the church in the messages of E.J. Waggoner and A.T. Jones. I believe that. Now if that is true, it means that Christ could have come about 1895 or so. If that had happened, of course some of the people at that conference in 1856 would have still been alive 40 years later to see Jesus come. Theoretically there is nothing keeping Christ from coming-- nor has there been anything keeping Him from coming-- since shortly after 1844, except the fact that the church has not made itself ready (Rev. 19: 7).

God is not waiting for particular political events to happen before He can come. He is only waiting for the church to be prepared, and when she is ready, He will allow those events prophesied in the Bible to happen. God wanted Christ to come for His church a long time ago, just He planned for the Israelites to go right into the Promised Land. It was only their stubbornness and refusal to believe and obey that kept them out and caused them to die in the wilderness. The same has been keeping the church from entering into the heavenly promised land.



As Paul said, "Let everyone be persuaded in their own mind." Read widely and ask the Lord to lead. May God bless!

Regards,
"John 3: 17"

I personally would not waste my time away from the scriptures reading these good books. At this point ... I don't see the point of studying all this. It just takes us away from the Light of God. In the end ... it does not matter one bit if Ellen was in error or not. It does not change how we should read her. It does not change her purpose for us which is to point us to the Greater Light.

All these divisive issues only hurt the church. Focus on the REAL thing. WE are to "abide in Him". I don't see how reading these books qualifies as abiding.

But if you are fascinated by this ... then by all means. But for me ... I will dwell with my Saviour. I will abide IN Him.