With all kindness, any comparison between EGW and this weirdo, sexually perverted guy is circumstancial. I am sure Wayne has worn shirts and socks and we all have worn shirts and socks but that doesn't mean we are like him.

Sure there are some SDA's who have been caught up in this (including him that used to be an SDA), and that is sad but it isn't because of our history it is because our church is a hospital for sinners not a country club for saints and when you are a hospital you have all kinds of "diseases" to deal with of strange people who might be in need of the psychiatric department of the hospital or something.

I agree there are some STRANGE SDA's out there but this Wayne Bent goes far beyond strange and anyone who would go along with him has to be under some type of influence as what he believes flies in the face of Biblical teachings no matter how much he tries to construe it to fit his perverted views. I am so glad the kids are now safe from this man. You are perfectly granted the right to take issue with EGW and that is fine but she was not sexually perverted, she didn't abuse kids, nor did she have multiple partners nor think she was Jesus. This guy is incredibly weird!

You need to read my post more carefully. I did not make a direct association with Wayne and EGW. This is what I DID say...



There are a number of contributing factors that are brought forth by Ellen White in her writings.

1) A painful practice of introspection. Simply read just about any Ellen White for a few pages and you'll come across this.

2) The teaching of an impending doom that requires urgency, loyalty, and unquestioning faith to survive.

3) Teaching people to ignore doubts because their nature is evil and not to be trusted.

4) Making low self esteem a virtue.

5) The overemphasis of the respect for authority within the organization.

6) A strong emphasis on the organization and its goals over the individual.

7) Systems of belief that keep people never good enough.


The few ways to get relief from these systems is to either let go of these beliefs and develop a non shame motivational core or to become some form of god yourself or to have someone in authority pronounce you worthy or the way most people do is to pick and choose some combination of beliefs.

This is why early forms of Adventist teaching and culture produced groups like those present at Strong City and were at Waco. They are the ultimate outcome of these systems of belief when people don't make their way out through alternatives.

Before Wayne Bent announced his Messiahship he had led these people into a community by promising them that he had a system to help them perfect their characters so they could be ready for the close of probation. This is right out of the Ellen White play book. His visionary and prophetic experiences are also very similar. While Ellen White did not claim to have a system to directly perfect one's character, she did say that it would be required so that we could stand before god without a mediator.

I know there are all kinds of complicated apologetics for this, but the simple answer is that she was creating all these ideas so that she could survive the shame of investing in William Miller's teachings. This created an atmosphere where there was always one more thing and if we work hard god will take us home to paradise.

Fortunately today this is not the majority experience of most Adventists, but in the past this was not true. You would find far more similar affects among Adventist believers that appeared much like those in the Strong City cult.

Ok Richard. I don't want to try to discredit you. But I still don't see EGW as controlling or anything in her teachings like this guy's teachings. I know you said he went FAR beyong anything she ever did or taught but I just don't see why her name even needs to come up, but then I don't see things the way you do, but yes we agree on one thing, this guy is nuts. :)

Maybe you don't see anything as absolute truth, but liquid depending on what an individual thinks or experiences. I agree there is a lot more grey than our "early church leaders" may have taught or believed but that doesn't take away that God's Word does have some clear black and whites.

The difference is that EGW did not sleep with all the men in the church. She told each and all that the Bible is the book to follow not her. I personally did not see any similarity's. I don't think that the Adventist Church is perfect by far. But neither are any other church. But I do believe that we follow the Bible princible's closer that any other Christian Church. Again we are not perfect. And I know as for me I am not a perfect Christian by no means, but only through Jesus I am.

Shabbat Shalom,
pkrause

It should be mentioned that everything that group is doing, and that leader is doing, is opposed to what both the Bible and Ellen White say to do.

It's impossible to explain the rise of the SDA church and Ellen White's life and teachings simply on the basis that Ellen White got "caught up" into believing something that was not true.

Check out Dramatic Prophecies of Ellen White by Herbert Edgar Douglass, and read the well-documented biography of Ellen White by Arthur White. Is it reasonable to believe that all this happened because Ellen White was under some kind of illusion?

The same criticisms are made of the Bible. There's nothing along these lines in Ellen White that cannot also be found in the Bible.



Ellen White did not have low self-esteem; and rightly understood, neither the Bible nor Ellen White favor low self-esteem. I can see how someone can think they do, but they're misreading and misinterpreting what both those sources are saying. There is also such a thing as false esteem. I think that if we really believe and understand that God loves us and that Christ died in order to save us, we can't continue for long to have low self-esteem. In fact, it should heighten our true self-esteem-- to the point where we won't let anyone exploit or use or abuse us.



Again, the same criticisms made of Ellen White's writing on these matters can be, and are, leveled against the Bible itself.

I think it's good to talk about things, but we need to remember that the wrongs we see in examples such as David Koresh and Wayne Bent are extremes. Good things are bad when taken to extreme. It's called fanaticism.



Interesting analysis. You have some good points, I think. I see the cults as taking something that was good and using it in a way that makes those good things into something evil. That is what David Koresh and Jim Jones did.

Hmmmmmm.......

Obviously, you are thinking that 1844 not only was a disappointment, but also a false interpretation...Because, if the prophecys regarding 1844 are incorrect, then there is no need for a prophetess/guide... Correct me if I am misinterpreting you here....

Assuming that is the case, how do you interprete Daniel? Literally, figuratively, prophectically? How?

My question for this is why does the SDA church produce such ultra conservative dysfunctional people? Why do people suspend belief in God, and superimpose a human who claims to be divinity/humanity combined? We already have that in the form of Jesus Christ.....

I don't think it's so much that the church produces such people, but it attracts such people. Take a look at any group of people who tend to lean toward either end of a liberal-conservative spectrum, and you will find kooks.