I'm referring to the way the gospel was presented by Christ, the disciples, and the apostles. Where do they proclaim the gospel of Christ as salvation that has already happened to everyone and that is ours even before we make any choice?

Yes, the sacrifice was made before we were born. But that is not the question. Where do they proclaim it by saying that all men are already justified and saved and that all we must do is accept the salvation that is already ours? Is it ever clearly put in that way in the NT?

I am not ignoring the Ellen White quote about babies. I believe it. I believe Ellen White was God's messenger and a true prophet. But that quote cannot be made the basis of how we present the gospel. We cannot make it the basis of our soteriology or our theology of mission. Ellen White never would have wanted that and she did not write it in order for it to be used in that way.

I agree with you that it's God's will that all men be saved. He does choose all men in that sense. But how do you account for the fact that some will be saved but most will be lost? Most people go down the broad road that leads to destruction, whereas a few travel the narrow road that leads to salvation. God wants everyone to arrive at the same destination. Why then, do you believe, do most arrive finally at the wrong place?

Read me!

Here's a sample:

I'm in Denver today, Sabbath, and since I can't get to a church, I'm enjoying studying Jack Sequiera's book, Christ Speaks to Laodicea. Have you read this book and do you believe all of it? (I asked you this once before on a different thread but am not sure if you saw it or answered.) I'm finding it very interesting and worth while. I'm a little over half way through. Except for the part about Job, I haven't seen anything that I would disagree with.

Some time I would be interested in devoting a thread to his book and to a discussion of it.

I have never known anyone who has actually been to the "final" destination. I am, rather, convinced that God wants us all to be with Him in eternity. I believe it is His choice, His will, His desire and His efforts that will ensure that not a single one of His children be lost eternally. I believe that God works with us and for us so that we each will come to an understanding of His will and of His divine love. I believe that now we only know "in part", but then, [i]i.e. sometime in the future, we will know "in full". I believe that ALL things are possible with God. I believe in a mysterious strange act in which God will demonstrate His unfailing love and will woo the hearts of everyone.

Jesus' death certainly shows that God loves everyone and that He wants everyone to be saved. He has opened the door to His Kingdom and invited everyone in-- but there are conditions to entering in, of course.

Many of the verses given above really speak of God as the sustainer of all humanity, despite the rebellion and sin. In this way, God's grace is extended to and falls upon all. None of us-- including those who hate God and want nothing to do with Him--would be alive now if it wasn't for Jesus Christ.

I see Romans 5: 10, 18 as teaching that it's through Christ that humanity is brought back into harmony with God, just as it was through Adam that man lost this harmony. Verses 18 and 19 are basically saying the same thing. (Remember that the verb in the last phrase of v. 18 is not in the original text but is supplied. It could just as easily be "leads" or "results" as "there resulted," etc.

I've read that link before. I know what Jack S. teaches on this subject. But what I am asking for are specific verses in Acts, for instance, which show the gospel being proclaimed in the way you've presented it here-- that is, as salvation or justification that has already happened before we were born or put our faith in Christ.

What do you think about the fact that the preaching and proclamation of the gospel in Acts does not reflect the idea that the whole world was justified at the time of Christ's death? At least I do not see it there. Do you?

OK, I think I understand. I did not know before what you believed about this topic.

I'm sure you've been asked before, and probably get tired of answering, the question about such verses as 2 Thess. 1: 7-9; 2: 8-10; Matt. 20: 46; and Rev. 20:9, among others. My question is, then, how does one believe that eventually all people will be saved, and harmonize the belief in universal salvation with the verses that teach otherwise?

Good question. Do you want my opinion; or do you want an in-depth answer with biblical texts which, in my opinion, support my beliefs? If it is the latter, it will take much more time than I have right now, but I am willing to take on the task and supply you with those answers (in time).

If you really think that in the end NO ONE will be lost including the demons, yeah, I for one would like to see your Biblical basis for such a belief.

Gerry

John, John, John...you're not listening! Please step back from your traditional dogma.

If you really read Sequeira then you should have read this: