That is essentially a postmodern position: There are no absolutes (absolutely!), and if there are, we cannot know them.

And if it is actually the truth, or a reflection of actual reality, or however it can be verified (an extremely difficult proposition from a postmodern perspective), then there is no point in having church doctrines, or church discipline, or any rules of any kind. Since every one sees everything differently, no disputes can ever be resolved. Treason is a matter of dates, and embezzlement is a disagreement over accounting techniques.

That's one of many reasons that postmodernism is ultimately nihilistic, and self-defeating.

I see a lot of give and take here....Combined, we are influenced by the good virtues that we attempt to express...IOWs, most of us are here to communicate and express our ideas. Sure, we are amazed by some of what some say here. And we argue with them. Yes, it is ok to disagree, even get spirited at times....There is nothing wrong with the exchanging of ideas....even good nature redicule...[now there's an oxymoron, but it happens!]

But for me, to take this type of action is to consistantly see posts that have double meanings, one meaning less agressive than the other, and when clarification is ask for, the response is "I never meant it like that. Where do you get that from?"...It is always the recievers' fault for misinterpreting the origionator of the post. If it happens once in a while, that is one thing....but when it continues to happen, I get a bit testy, admitedly.

I have seen some powerful people in church use this tactic, and the church has allowed it to continue and the results are always the same...the abuser continues to abuse and use the same tactics. His behavior is rewarded as people are bullied into submission and then avoid him. The people say things like, "we need to model proper behavior for him." "Oh he doesn't mean it." or " He's so good at other areas.We need him."

Each of these excuses are classic examples of platitudes that make no sense. "Model proper behavior?" The man is an adult. In this case, he is also a teacher AND a principal. He KNOWS what is good behavior!!! And he means every word he says....He is also an author. He has NO EXCUSE. Our church has been browbeaten by strong willed individuals, so much so that I have to ask, at what point do we need to stand up for ourselves? At what point, are we going to say, I refuse to be held hostage for your bad behavior, when you can obviously display good behavior.

In a community like this, responsiblity for discipline has been given to the users [looking over at Stan and raising the eyebrow for commformation?]. In a community such as this, when is the community to collectively come to the bully and say, "We have modeled proper behavior and it is time for you to come up to our standards."? If the bully will not toe the line, at what point does members of the community take disciplinary action? ...and in what form..?

My shortening Ed's handle to Ichy is a result of his behavior.It was explained that why at the begining..And there has been absolutely NO consequences to his past behavior, nor any indication that he is willing to express remorse over any part of the communication. If he shows any sort of willingness to say that he is sorry for misbehaving or poor communication skills or SOMETHING along those lines, I am MORE than willing to drop the shortened handle....Believe me when I say that I am not exactly 'thrilled' to be using it...But given my options as to what I can use for discipline, I chooose something with some humor....better that than with rancor.

There is not a parent here who is not willing to discipline a child when he/she is out of control. If we have an adult bully, at what point do we stand up to him and say, "enough"?

Suck up!!!!!!

What is that about? Suck up for what?

your comment came right after this one.....

"Women are near perfect... ranking alphabetically of course"

OH ok. I didn't understand. I meant something different by my comment but that's all right.

Just teasing you....and it was worth it....

That's ok...Redwood said something a while back, and I got suckered into a misunderstanding....some consturnation was spread around,...I felt a bit foolish...Oh well...

[going to the reading lab-bor-it-tory and perusing Redwood's threads for something to get even by...muahahahahhahaha]

Oh yeah I know what you're talking about. LOL.

That was something all right. Glad it ended fast.

Excuse my ignorance Neil. But what are you referring to? My poppy growing?

To change the subject ... if you are concerned about discipline regarding Ed. All he has to do is to stop by where you are the moderator and you can ban him from the entire Forum for 30 days. According to the rules that Stan has outlined. Just imagine!!!

Have fun ....

And by the way ... why would I ever "snucker" you.

You is my friend.

I didn't say that you "snuckered" me, I said that you said something and **I** got suckered into thinking something...