A planet by definition is orbiting around it's sun. I believe God made our solar system as a unit at some point in time and then made the planet we call Earth habitable eventually. Details of how that was accomplished are lacking but EGW thot that the planning of that event was a factor in Lucifer's discontent. The planning details (like what a kangaroo looks like) may have taken considerable time. I think it is harmless and fun to imagine those details. I just wish that we were given more information. mel

Is that God's definition or are we playing a game of semantics?

"The EARTH was formless and void... and God said.. let the EARTH bring forth ..."



All this - before God made the Sun.

Or maybe He is either just not that good at it -- or else not good at saying what He did?




True enough - we do not have the "how to" do-it-yourself guide that many evolutionist think they can imagine.

in Christ,

Bob

That's an OK theory, like I said. To be as diplomatic as possible, if I where teaching Creation, I guess I would include that theory as a possibility.

I would say the other theory appeals to some, because of what we see in the Universe now. Trillions of stars, like our sun, probably with planets around them. So it's not hard to imagine God going to one of these solar systems and creating life on a planet.

And alot of people believe that God has done this before, many times, before creating this world.

I know Kent Hovind, (aka: Dr. Dino), suggests that this is the only world God ever created, and on the 4th day, the whole Universe was created. This would mean the angels also where created on the 4th day, cause they are like stars, and the fall of Lucifer happened after the creation of this world.

But he does not accept the testimonies of Ellen White, which say that there are many worlds inhabited by sinless people, where they never ate from the wrong tree.

I would assume those worlds where created before this one, and the world we live on now, is the last world God has created. For 2 reasons mainly, and 3, (hmm).

1. If the other worlds never ate the forbidden fruit, then it's likely they had more knowledge and wisdom than Adam and Eve. They had probably been around a long time before Lucifer fell.

2. It's hard to imagine God wanting to off creating worlds after the fall of Lucifer. The politically correct thing to do would be for God to focus all His attention trying to reconcile Lucifer. Then we would assume God finally got to the point where He had done everything toward reconciliation. God finally gave up and created this one world. Probably God knew Lucifer would have a chance at deceiving these new-born people, knowing they probably would fall and this is where the plan of salvation would play out, and his deceptions would be unmasked.

3. And I sure couldn't imagine God going off creating worlds when this world is in the crisis that it is in. I believe God has been focusing all of His attention in this world to reconcile sinners.

True enough. And If God had said "int he beginning the earth was formless and void as day by day the sun rose and set over an endless sea of water" we could certainly see how such a thing could be rolled into that story.

But there is no cosmology that allows for a planet around a sun without light that suddenly ignites 6,000 years ago at the same time that the planet forms land.

There is no biology that supposes that all plant life originates on earth before the Sun is actually visible in the sky as an object of light.

In other words God has framed the story such that the gap between the sequence He describes and the one that one might imagine if one were imagining solar system evolution -- is not the same. His account is then a kind of "in your face" account that is counter to what we might expect if things were happening on their own.



Me too. In fact I suspect most SDAs would admit that other planets existed with life on them before the earth.

in Christ,

Bob

" all you need is a rotating planet not an orbiting one"
If it's not orbiting it's not a planet! :-) mel

It "appears" to me that by the time mankind got to the point of telling God what a planet was -- He had already created the earth and it was already orbiting one of those TWO great lights He made on day four!

Why would it say that? It says darkness was upon the face of the deep. Now, go to Venus, and that's what it is there. Perfect darkness. There is no sun shining, or rising, or setting on Venus. The atmosphere is too thick.

And the sun is not in the sky, anyway, as it says in Gen 1. But that's where we say it is, because that's where it appears to be. To this day, we still say the sun is in the sky, but the sky is where the clouds are. Technically, you could say, the sun is not in the sky, yet it is, from our perspective.

And that's what it says:

Gen. 1:14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven...

The firmament is not outer space. It's the sky. It's where the clouds are. It's the atmosphere.

Gen. 1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
1:7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters which [were] above the firmament: and it was so.
1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry [land] appear: and it was so.

Now, I'm using Genesis as my lesson book. I'm not consulting the Atheists here.

I do not deny the six literal days.

But I do have concern for the dating of the rocks thing. Why are we focusing on the rocks, like we got something to prove there. The rocks would have already been here, like there are rocks on every other planet in the Universe.

And also I do not believe the stars where created the 4th day. The stars are the whole Universe. Did God create the whole Universe on the 4th day?

What do you say about those other worlds?

Was this the first world God created? Then when the other worlds where created, it would have said something different about their 4th day, concerning the stars?

To me, that's not likely.

I suspect this is the last world God created - but that is a guess.

The wording of the text of Gen 1 does not lead the reader to suppose that the sun was here until Day 4 when it says that "God Made TWO great lights" the greater and the lesser -- if what he meant to say "On day four God caused the thick clouds to pass away" then we certainly have things like "thick cloud lifted" etc in Hebrew being used by Moses in other places.

In fact one way that the Bible speaks of the Sun shining but covered by clouds in the OT is "Sun does not give her light".

It is instructive that this is not the language Moses used here.

in Christ,

Bob

What if..... when Moses was out there watching sheep for Jethro he asked God about how things began and God showed Moses a video. Perhaps Moses wrote about it the way it appeared to him. From his perspective if the clouds did not clear until the fourth day that would be what he would write.
By the way if the moon was to rule the night why does it not remain "full" all the time? Could it be that it was that way originally?
mel

QR frame:

I think that Genesis 1:6-9 establishes that the firmament was established beneath the upper layer of earth's divided waters. Moreover,

verse 20 tells us birds flew in that firmament.

Given the above, it is hardly likely that the greater and the lesser lights placed in the firmament between the stratified waters of earth – can be said to have been the sun and the moon. The stars are an unknowable parenthesis.

It may serve us to remember that the antediluvian world was not as the post-diluvian world.

So, if the above obtains, when then, were the sun and the moon created? If they were created in a long eons ago creation, why did they not serve as the greater and lesser lights of day four of the Genesis 1 creation?

Re moon:

Good observations mel. That said, Babylon first worshipped the moon. Towards the end of its Empire, it again was in the process of reverting to moon worship.

There seems to be, again, those who worship the moon – and why not? if they believe that though the sun rules the day – the moon rules both day and night...