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Welcome with open arms fellow believers who don’t see things the way you do.
And don’t jump all over them every time they do or say something you don’t agree with
– even when it seems that they are strong on opinions but weak in the faith department.
Remember, they have their own history to deal with. Treat them gently. Romans 14.1: The Message
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#25906 - 02/14/05 10:42 PM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: Ron W]
Nicodema Offline


Registered: 11/22/03
Posts: 777
Loc: Beyond your grasp
Quote:

Maybe we should take heed to this. Are we ready to give the final message if that message comes to us through those we deem "heathen".




Amen, Dave!
_________________________
"After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot

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#25907 - 02/15/05 06:16 AM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: ]
Sid Offline


Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 1241
Loc: CA
Quote:

Soldiers were at once sent to Bethlehem, with orders to put to death all the children of two years and under...

This calamity the Jews had brought upon themselves...they had separated themselves from God by their sins, and had rejected the Holy Spirit, which was their only shield.




These types of passages are useful to me, because in my battle with temptations, sometimes, the turning point for me to overcome temptation is fear of God. I know that He is loving, and merciful, and quick to forgive, but I also know that the wages of sin is death.

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#25908 - 02/15/05 06:28 AM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: lastsupper]
Sid Offline


Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 1241
Loc: CA
Quote:

They had not studied the Scriptures with a desire to conform to the will of God. They had searched for prophecies which could be interpreted to exalt themselves, and to show how God despised all other nations.




This serves as a reminder to me to always pray before I study the bible, so that He may guide me. It's a bit scary to think of how well they must've known the bible, yet still have rejected Him.

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#25909 - 02/15/05 02:55 PM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: Ron W]
cricket Offline


Registered: 11/11/03
Posts: 4903
Thank you for sharing this explanation. It makes it a little more clear to me.
_________________________
http://tinyurl.com/6ncnzl

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#25910 - 02/15/05 03:55 PM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: Ron W]
bevin Offline


Registered: 09/04/02
Posts: 4699
Loc: New England
Quote:

The reason we accociate Egypt with Atheism is based on Rev. 11:7-9.

7 Now when they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them, and overpower and kill them.
8 Their bodies will lie in the street of the great city, which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified.
9 For three and a half days men from every people, tribe, language and nation will gaze on their bodies and refuse them burial. (NIV)





But there is nothing in those texts about atheism!

/Bevin

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#25911 - 02/15/05 09:29 PM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: ]
DaveM1936 Offline


Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 844
Loc: Illinois
Quote:

That's nice, but it does not change HISTORY. Egypt was NOT an atheist nation, and there is no precedent for assigning it such a symbol. Just because Pharoah said he didn't know "The Lord" doesn't mean he did not pray to his own voluminous pantheon of Gods, as history attests, unless they were already in the period known as the "heresy of Amen-ra" since Amen-Ra proposed monotheism for the first time in Egypt.




First, he was praying to non-existent gods. Second, he denied the existence of the only existing God.

Quote:

"The great city" in whose streets the witnesses are slain, and where their dead bodies lie, is "spiritually" Egypt. Of all nations presented in Bible history, Egypt most boldly denied the existence of the living God and resisted His commands. No monarch ever ventured upon more open and highhanded rebellion against the authority of Heaven than did the king of Egypt. When the message was brought him by Moses, in the name of the Lord, Pharaoh proudly answered: "Who is Jehovah, that I should hearken unto His voice to let Israel go? I know not Jehovah, and moreover I will not let Israel go." Exodus 5:2, A.R.V. This is atheism, and the nation represented by Egypt would give voice to a similar denial of the claims of the living God and would manifest a like spirit of unbelief and defiance. "The great city" is also compared, "spiritually," to Sodom. The corruption of Sodom in breaking the law of God was especially manifested in licentiousness. And this sin was also to be a pre-eminent characteristic of the nation that should fulfill the specifications of this scripture. {GC 269.2}




Openly dening the existence of God is Atheism.

Your friend,
Dave M

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#25912 - 02/15/05 10:34 PM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: Ron W]
DaveM1936 Offline


Registered: 07/06/03
Posts: 844
Loc: Illinois
The following paragraph struck me this morning.

Quote:

The magi had been among the first to welcome the Redeemer. Their gift was the first that was laid at His feet. And through that gift, what privilege of ministry was theirs! The offering from the heart that loves, God delights to honor, giving it highest efficiency in service for Him. If we have given our hearts to Jesus, we also shall bring our gifts to Him. Our gold and silver, our most precious earthly possessions, our highest mental and spiritual endowments, will be freely devoted to Him who loved us, and gave Himself for us. {DA 65.2}





Sometimes I feel that to devote all I have, am, and possess, even mentally to God is a great sacrifice. I need time to take care of my own needs. There is baseball and football. I have my pets. What about TV. Does God expect me to deny myself any or all of these pleasures and duties?

I thought about the great sacrifice for Dave that Jesus' love drove Him to do. He took on my human nature. The Godhead is forever changed. Then He died a torturious death for Dave. When He rose, He rose with a human nature forever. When I think about this great steadfast love, this dependablity, this forgiveness, this offer of eternal life, I cannot help but respond with love for Him.

What He is asking of me is to let Him work through me to share heaven with others. If I truly love Him, and am filled with His love, then I will not be able to stop myself from reaching out to others. I will naturally tell others how to accept Him and what He would like for us to do.

Your friend,
Dave M

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#25913 - 02/16/05 04:56 AM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: Ron W]
Nicodema Offline


Registered: 11/22/03
Posts: 777
Loc: Beyond your grasp
Quote:

First, he was praying to non-existent gods. Second, he denied the existence of the only existing God.




Yes but "praying to non-existent gods" is universally labeled in Judaeo-Christian Scripture as idolatry, not atheism. All pagan gods are "non-existent" to the monotheistic believer. And as Bevin pointed out, there is nothing in those texts about atheism.

I would prefer we not detract from this study any more in debating this matter. Let us simply agree to disagree, and if you wish to bring it up further as a point of debate perhaps a new thread under "Bible and Theology" is warranted. Thanks for understanding.
_________________________
"After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot

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#25914 - 02/16/05 05:01 AM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: lastsupper]
Nicodema Offline


Registered: 11/22/03
Posts: 777
Loc: Beyond your grasp
Quote:

They had not studied the Scriptures with a desire to conform to the will of God. They had searched for prophecies which could be interpreted to exalt themselves, and to show how God despised all other nations.




America ought to take heed lest she repeat the same error.
_________________________
"After such knowledge, what forgiveness?" -- T.S. Eliot

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#25915 - 02/16/05 05:07 AM Re: Ch. 6: "We Have Seen His Star" [Re: ]
Sid Offline


Registered: 09/27/04
Posts: 1241
Loc: CA
Good point!

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