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#80801 - 05/02/06 02:58 AM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: Billy Dennis]
Shane Offline
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Registered: 02/02/02
Posts: 17005
Loc: Rio Grande Valley, Texas
So in the theistic evolutionary belief (that God used millions of years to create the universe) death occured in animals, plants, fungi, etc. before man came along. The "soul" did not exist until man was created. Death came to man when he seperated himself from God through sin.

So wouldn't it follow that after the world is destroyed and recreated, it will be as it was before man fell into sin? There will continue to be death among the plants, animals, fungi, etc?

The whole scenario is far outside of what Scripture says.

"The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid; and the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; and a little child shall lead them. And the cow and the bear shall feed; their young ones shall lie down together: and the lion shall eat straw like the ox." Isaiah 11:6,7

"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." Rev. 21:4
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#80802 - 05/23/06 08:51 AM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: mausman]
yongttay Offline


Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 119
Loc: Washington, USA

Quote:

"So wouldn't it follow that after the world is destroyed and recreated, it will be as it was before man fell into sin? There will continue to be death among the plants, animals, fungi, etc?"

If man eat fruits and plants and lion shall eat straw like the ox in the new earth, wouldn't there be death to the plants and the grass?

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#80803 - 05/23/06 04:16 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: ]
Shane Offline
Administrator of Foro Adventista

Registered: 02/02/02
Posts: 17005
Loc: Rio Grande Valley, Texas
Well, I am no scientist but no matter how often I mow my lawn it continues to grow back.

Eating an apple will not kill an apple tree however the apple is composed of cells which are living matter. Once it falls from the tree it is cut off from its life source and its death begins. So if we believe the Bible, there will be death to fruit cells.

So when the Bible says, “And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.” (Revelation 21:4) either it is not including fruit cells or fruit will not be the same as it is here. Yet, if lions are eating grass, I think it safe to assume they are not eating other animals because "there shall be no more death."
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#80804 - 05/23/06 08:50 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: mausman]
claborn1960 Offline


Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 165
Loc: Huntsville, AL
sin did not cause death.... think about it...the tree of life was in the garden.... had sinless Adam and Eve stopped eating from that tree what would have happened?
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#80805 - 05/23/06 09:24 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: Gerhard Ebersoeh]
Shane Offline
Administrator of Foro Adventista

Registered: 02/02/02
Posts: 17005
Loc: Rio Grande Valley, Texas
It is Ellen White that says the tree of life would have allowed Adam and Eve to live foreaver. I do not believe that is in the Bible. And I am also not aware that she wrote that eternal life depends on eating from the tree of life.

Interesting thoughts though...
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#80806 - 05/23/06 10:07 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: mausman]
claborn1960 Offline


Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 165
Loc: Huntsville, AL
Quote:

It is Ellen White that says the tree of life would have allowed Adam and Eve to live foreaver. I do not believe that is in the Bible. And I am also not aware that she wrote that eternal life depends on eating from the tree of life.

Interesting thoughts though...


Adam and Eve did not have inherent immortality.... they got it from the tree of life... stands to reason that if they stopped eating from that tree, eventually they would die.... Likewise their banishment from the garden suggests that The Creator did not want them to continue eating from the tree of life, lest the live forever as sinners.... So it is implied... Just as Cain marrying one of his sisters is implied....
_________________________
"Change takes but an instant. It's the resistance to change that can take a lifetime." - Hebrew Proverb

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#80807 - 05/23/06 10:33 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: Gerhard Ebersoeh]
Shane Offline
Administrator of Foro Adventista

Registered: 02/02/02
Posts: 17005
Loc: Rio Grande Valley, Texas
"Sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned!" (Rom. 5:12)
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#80808 - 05/23/06 10:38 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: Gerhard Ebersoeh]
yongttay Offline


Registered: 05/14/05
Posts: 119
Loc: Washington, USA

So it is not sin that cause death, but the depriving of eating from the tree of life is the cause of death.

When God said "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." Gen 2:17. Does this verse imply that God punish the human race to death by not allowing him to eat from the tree of life.

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#80809 - 05/23/06 10:59 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: ]
claborn1960 Offline


Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 165
Loc: Huntsville, AL
Quote:


So it is not sin that cause death, but the depriving of eating from the tree of life is the cause of death.

When God said "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die." Gen 2:17. Does this verse imply that God punish the human race to death by not allowing him to eat from the tree of life.




Gen 3:22 And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil; and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:

Seems that the Creator did not want them to have unlimited access to the Tree of Life...
_________________________
"Change takes but an instant. It's the resistance to change that can take a lifetime." - Hebrew Proverb

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#80810 - 05/23/06 10:59 PM Re: Origins > Sin & Death [Re: mausman]
claborn1960 Offline


Registered: 08/18/04
Posts: 165
Loc: Huntsville, AL
Quote:

"Sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned!" (Rom. 5:12)


ummm and this fits into the discussion how?
_________________________
"Change takes but an instant. It's the resistance to change that can take a lifetime." - Hebrew Proverb

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